Fountains

Here you can ask for advice, or even just post your favorite compositions + methods!

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Tyvole
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Fountains

Post by Tyvole »

Ok folks, new topic. I would like to make up some pretty, ground-based fountain fireworks that won't just self-destruct on me. I now have a reasonable inventory of different chems for colours, a few metals etc. I have a 1-ton arbor press and a decent assortment of tubes. I don't really want to get into rolling cones...
I have never tried to make fountains before and have no idea where to start. Can any among you give me some lessons to get me started?
"If you don't learn anything, what's the point?"
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Aardvark
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Re: Fountains

Post by Aardvark »

Nothing much to offer in the way of advice but I've seen a TT comp based fountain that looked very nice. Should be a fairly easy one. Not sure where I saw it though, sorry bud.

Look forward to your progression, always interested in anything that won't upset the neighbours!
coalman
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Re: Fountains

Post by coalman »

Start simply? I made simple fountains ages before I had access to more detailed information and at the simplest you just mix, fill and see what it's like, then change to suit your taste. Simple comps with larger metal filings can create some lovely effects. Back then I hadn't even heard of milling or anything fancy. Find a recipe and go for it - safely of course.
Search engine with "turbopyro.pdf" for some instructions on one way to do high quality fountains along with other stuff.
Niall
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Re: Fountains

Post by Niall »

Cones require some of their own tooling and quite seperate methods and don't really seem to be abundant in the hobby, to my knowledge.

You could start with BP/RP titanium/magnalium fountains. Or are you saying you gave berm there already?

Important note: never use more than 10% metal by total mass in BP/RP mixes.

The tolerance is somewhat higher, but then do is the risk, so my standard advice rules out anything above 10%.

Magnalium will give sparks, titanium will give trails. Aluminum will give bright trails. Antimony trisulphide might not be visible in the effect. Aluminium flitter will give fireflies. Avoid copper and magnesium.
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Pyro-Gear
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Re: Fountains

Post by Pyro-Gear »

Tyvole wrote:Ok folks, new topic. I would like to make up some pretty, ground-based fountain fireworks that won't just self-destruct on me. I now have a reasonable inventory of different chems for colours, a few metals etc. I have a 1-ton arbor press and a decent assortment of tubes. I don't really want to get into rolling cones...
I have never tried to make fountains before and have no idea where to start. Can any among you give me some lessons to get me started?

Depending on what size tube you intend to use and the fact you have a press now it may be a good idea to make a tool to form the nozzle for your fountain, you may have to improvise with some dowel and some brass or other non-sparking material for a ¾ tube a nozzle of 6-7mm should be ok.
Most cones were nothing more than a tube in a cone but they looked good.
davidg
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Re: Fountains

Post by davidg »

I will post a couple of formulae tomorrow and the method I use
Tyvole
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Re: Fountains

Post by Tyvole »

@PG Ok, I can do that. I have to improvise almost everything! ;-)
Do these things need a core (beyond what little might be needed for introducing a fuse)? I kind of assumed they wouldn't.
I guess I'll need two rammers; one with a bevelled end for the nozzle, one flat for the mix.
@D Thank you, I look forward to that.
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Starfire
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Re: Fountains

Post by Starfire »

Here's a small one with dragon egg waste it had a 6mm nozzle.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iM79lbGhLQk
Tyvole
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Re: Fountains

Post by Tyvole »

@Niall I won't be doing cones - too complicated. I understand the thing about a high % of metals making the mix sensitive. I have regular 250 mesh MgAl, Al flake, FeTi and Zinc. Since the nozzle is a reasonable size, could I also use bigger particles (e.g. fine filings) of, say, Al and steel? Just curious - I don't have plain Mg, but what's the problem with copper? Is it dodgy or does it just not work?

@Starfire I like the idea of using waste crumbs from stars - cutting creates quite a bit of that. Is that simply mixed in with a BP 'host'?

If using dry star mix, do I use it as-is or 'dilute' it with BP? I won't have incompatibility issues, as I don't use any chlorates.

So many questions! ;-)
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Pyro-Gear
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Re: Fountains

Post by Pyro-Gear »

It’s possible the reference to copper is a little confused, I think what your thinking is cupric oxide and this can be used in some Gerb formulations, copper powder on the other hand is not desirable.
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Pyro-Gear
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Re: Fountains

Post by Pyro-Gear »

Starfire wrote:Here's a small one with dragon egg waste it had a 6mm nozzle.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iM79lbGhLQk
Nice dragon eggs, what composition was that Starfire?
Niall
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Re: Fountains

Post by Niall »

Yes, I mean the metal powders not salts, the antimony salt was noted for its known spark effects.

Copper and its salts are a curious range. There are surprisingly more compatability issues across the board than seem to be commonly known. I think they deserve a post on their own. I need to rewrite on primes at some point too. PG and I were discussing putting articles and links in the 'useful files' section for reference, then discussing them in the relevant topic heading. I must make time to make a sensible prime write up using Richard's file.
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Starfire
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Re: Fountains

Post by Starfire »

@Tyvole yes they were mixed with bp and pressed,
@PG it was bismuth trioxide formula primed with bp will have a look for my comp can't find it at the moment.
davidg
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Re: Fountains

Post by davidg »

Hi Starfire,I hope these ideas are of some use.

RED
Strontium Nitrate 58%
Magnalium (30-60Mesh) 12%
Alumininium (30-60Mesh) 23%
Parlon (or PVC) 2%

GREEN
Barium Nitrate 58%
Magnalium (30-60Mesh) 12%
Aluminium (30-60Mesh) 23%
Parlon (or PVC) 2%


Remaining 5% can be a mix of eg Titanium sponge
Lamplack
Flitter Aluminium
Coarse charcoal (pref pine)
Iron filings

Method:

Mix ingredients (except metals) through a kitchen sieve 2 or three times until intimately mixed.
put in a ziploc bag and add metals. Shake gently until the mix is fairly uniform.

Requires 2 rammers one flat ended and one tapered at about 30 degrees

Tubes: 3/4" ID
Seal 1 tube end with tape
Add 4 grams bentonite to tube and compact with the tampered rammer.

Add about 4 grams of mix to the tube at a time and gently compact. I use a press for this but a mallet can be used as well bearing in mind the potential dangers.

Fill to approximately half an inch of the top,compact and then add bentonite to fill and compact this.

Tak a drill bit of the required size for a nozzle,(6mm-10mm) and hand twist it at the end where the tape was(is) until you are through to the composition.

Add a small amount of BP fines as a first fire to the hole and add a length of visco. Tape over to prevent leakage and you are good to go.

I like to add microstars of various types to this after an increment of the colour mix has been added and compacted,finishing off with microstars at the bottom.

You can use also BP fines for a fountain and add metals,lamplack or coarse charcoal to vary the effect.

For the coloured ones,you can mix 50/50 Barium Nitrate/Strontium Nitrate.
Tyvole
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Re: Fountains

Post by Tyvole »

Thanks Starfire and Davidg, you've both given me some useful starting info. I'll have a go with this when I've extended the base of my press to allow for the tube length.

@Davidg I'd be a bit nervous about including microstars, in case they obstructed the nozzle. What size microstars were you using?

@Starfire If I'm going to use a coloured star comp combined with BP, should I 'granulate' the star comp first to about 20 mesh? Because of the likely presence of metals, I would do this by dampening the mix, allowing it to dry a bit then manually crumbling before final drying. Or should I granulate the BP and leave the star mix as powder? Either approach would seem to make more sense to me than just mixing a bunch of powdered ingredients.
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davidg
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Re: Fountains

Post by davidg »

1 to 2mm
Tyvole
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Re: Fountains

Post by Tyvole »

Aha, I'm guessing they weren't pumped or cut then. ;-)
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davidg
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Re: Fountains

Post by davidg »

No,they were rolled using PG's star roller.
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Pyro-Gear
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Re: Fountains

Post by Pyro-Gear »

The star roller seems to have its uses
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